Rudolf is talking to Berlin-based artist and occultist Hagen von Tulien. He was a key figure of the I.O.T. in the 1990s, its German section head, is a Master of the Fraternitas Saturni and empowered adept of the Voudon Gnostic Current. And he is a very fine artist working in a variety of media. He is the living proof that Magic is Art, and Art is Magic!